Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

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Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby re-rose rose » Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:12 pm

Smithsonian Gold awaits, if anyone has reason to be in Washington, DC

The First Johnson-Smithsonian Deep-Sea Expedition to the West Indies

Folder 4 Original Notes on First Caroline expedition in 1933, made by Anthony Wilding
Box 3 of 19

Folder 5 Pilot balloon observations, 1933
Box 3 of 19

Folder 6 Log, taken on board the Caroline, including soundings, thermometer corrections, 1933
Box 3 of 19

Folder 7 Sonic Soundings taken by Lieutenant T. Townsend Brown, United States Naval Reserve, 1933
Box 3 of 19

Folder 8 Correspondence, notes, blueprint of the Caroline, 1926-1933, which includes the following: Eldridge R. Fenimore Johnson to Bartsch regarding a winch for the expedition, 5/8/1933.
Box 3 of 19

Folder 9 Blueprints, which include the following: Drum storage area, Caroline; Hoist Installation on main deck of Caroline; Deep-sea dredging winch; Underwater camera
Box 3 of 19

Folder 10 Photographs of the Caroline and members on the expedition
Box 3 of 19

Folder 11 Newspaper clippings related to the Johnson-Smithsonian Deep-Sea Expedition, No. 1, 1933.

http://siarchives.si.edu/collections/siris_arc_217247

rose
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby nate » Tue Jul 26, 2016 1:47 am

Hi Rose! Thanks very much for this! I have a strong sense of deja-vu reading this description. Based on some of the names and phrases that trigger associations in my mind, I'm fairly certain that this material was in one of the underground information packets circulating through the 'antigravity' scene in the mid-late 1980s.

Makes sense: someone following the Moore/Berlitz/Schraffranke/Deyo/Bearden/Childress 'psychohippie' scene who had read some of the 1978 books describing Townsend Brown and building him up as a semi-mystical figure, 'the wizard of electrogravity' to use Moore's term, must have done a library search for any mention of his name. If this was on file at the Smithsonian it would naturally have come up. So they pulled it and self-published it. Wish I could track down who it was, but it was almost certainly self-published or by a very small press, so no ISBN number. This was all pre-desktop-publishing era, so it would literally have been photocopies, I think. With very little commentary, because that was hard to publish then. Confused the heck out of me as a result; all these scientific and history papers, no explanation or context attached. Quite probably advertised either in the Popular Science classified ads, or in the ad section of David Hatcher Childress books. Very low-budget, zine-y. Very small audience. I just happened to be in the fragmentation zone to get hit by the mental debris as a teenager.

If I remember correctly, the same packet also included data about the Vening Meinesz submarine cruise, and that would have been for the same reason, that it was in academic libraries and so answering to an archive search request. Also, I believe, newspaper articles referencing Townsend's presence in Hawaii for 'electroculture'.

This packet did not include the letters in the Gray Barker files; as private correspondence, that wouldn't have been available to an archive search without knowing exactly where it was. That information surfaced (in front of me anyway) a few years later, I think in the early 90s. Nor, I think, did it include the scientific literature search for electrohydrodynamics or Faraday electrogravity; if I recall, those two were by a different underground author, as they came with some scientifically-informed commentary stitching the photocopied archival material together. The 'Townsend Brown' file search packet, as far as I recall, didn't. It was this kind of stuff plus newspaper articles mentioning his name.

The Vening Meinesz cruise material also didn't, I think, have any mention of an earthquake. At least not the first-person account (via Twigsnapper?) that appears in Defying Gravity. Again that makes sense as the search was limited to publically accessible archival documents as of the mid 1980s.

Right now I can't remember if this packet included a note about Smith's death / funeral, or if this was in a different packet or an unrelated later article (perhaps in Nexus magazine or one of its siblings). Along with the suggestion that Smith was CIA or some other kind of spy, which I'm sure would not have been in any public material. But that was also a thing I encountered in the late 1980s or very early 90s. Someone had already at that point drawn a line connecting Smith with the Townsend Brown family, and I'm quite curious now as to who that might have been, and how.

(If Smith's death was indeed faked, then this might be a reason? Somehow his civilian cover had become breached in the mid-80s and so he had to do something drastic?)

Similarly, one of these packets I believe included biographical material about Ilya Tolstoy and William Stephenson - and, I think, Jacques Bergier? Or whoever the French Resistance guy was who ended up in a WW2 Russian detention camp? Either that or it was Childress. Unfortunately I don't yet understand how a connecting line was drawn between these two and Townsend Brown, but there must have been one. I'd almost be willing to say I encountered this Stephenson connection rumour before the release of Peter Wright's 'Spycatcher', which was July 1987, though in hindsight that seems very early. Because I seem to remember Wright's name being attached to the material I'd read, and so eagerly anticipating Spycatcher as possibly breaking this whole thing into the sunlight. And being bitterly disappointed that it didn't (except for the reference to the Great Seal bug which was alluded to in the underground material). So early 1987 perhaps? That would make sense, I think. Just as a time reference, if anyone can draw a line as to who might have been doing this research and publishing.

Today this would all have occurred on blogs and web forums. The pre-Google era did have its researchers; they just haven't left quite the same paper trail as we have today (which is ironic because this hard-to-trace stuff involved actual paper). But who knows what self-published manuscripts might yet surface in garage sales or estates, should someone notice and scan them in.

I have very strong memories of high school, poring over these documents trying to read between the lines and work out if Deyo's and Childress' breathless speculations were true and if there really had been a secret high-level US gravity control project in the 1950s, culminating in man-made saucers at Pine Gap in 1979. And being fairly disappointed that Townsend's name only seemed to be attached to measuring gravity in the 1930s, not controlling it.

(I was even more frustrated with Childress' stuff, as he didn't seem to care about accuracy or that his various documents conflicted wildly with each other; he just pulled anything anyone gave him with the word 'gravity' in it, photocopied it, and shoved it together. Very very messy and unscholarly.)

By the way, the cover of Deyo's 1978 'Cosmic Conspiracy', with a pyramid with a rose on top, makes oddly strong reference to Masonic and Rosicrucian imagery for a supposedly evangelical Christian book - as does Deyo's oddly mannered writing style, with its talk of 'kabalistic' encoding and levels of secrets. I'd take that as a reasonably strong suggestion myself that Deyo was prior to the late 70s personally involved in some kind of Masonic and/or Rosicrucian order(s) and picked up certain habits of thought. As opposed to, eg, just joining an apocalyptic evangelical group and becoming terrified about Masons and Illuminati as an outsider without inside knowledge. The way he writes in stilted, coded phrases is NOT at all like how a normal evangelical of the era would. While I don't subscribe to Deyo's apocalypticism, since AMORC appears in Tom Bearden's circle, and then we have Hoagland going on about Southern Scottish Rite connections to NASA, the connection seems somewhat significant to me, though I can't infer much more beyond that. (Why I want to read Vallee and get a sense of what he knew about the landscape of secret orders in the 70s-80s UFO cult scene).

Regards, Nate
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby re-rose rose » Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:41 pm

[duplicate post]
Last edited by re-rose rose on Wed Jul 27, 2016 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby re-rose rose » Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:02 pm

Nate,
I believe the Venig Meinescz research was seen as part of 1932's 2nd International Polar Year research program.

International Meteorological Organization promoted IPY-2 to investigate the global implications of the newly discovered “jet stream,” and 40 nations
responded. IPY-2 emphasized observations in meteorology,magnetism, atmospheric science, and ionospheric mapping,in support of increasing knowledge of radioscience


Though research at the poles was the focus of the 1932 IPY, research was also carried out in other locations, co-ordinated by Sidney Chapman (source: found in a sentence snippet returned by google books). Those would have likely been the
new magnetic stations established in the equatorial regions and in the Southern Hemisphere.https://books.google.com/books?id=wYX9G ... ar&f=false

It was Chapman, who, 20 years later, was to be the senior member among the American/British/Canadian group responsible for organizing the 57-58 IGY. The core of that group shared a common historical interest and involvement in the Carnegie Terrestrial Magnetism research project of the thirties.

It has been written that much of the 1932 IGY data was "lost" to the world, due to the hostilities leading up to WWII. I wonder if, when the Cady report stated that Townsend said he had lost his post 1932 data sets, they were "lost" in the same place?

Interesting, isn't it, that the following year after the Vening Meinesz expedition, the SS Caroline returned to the Carribean equipped with sonar, underwater camera, and pilot balloons which must have carried radiosondes and magnetographs. As a sailing laboratory, she might well have visited many of the new magnetic research locations on that cruise.

The Caroline was the embodiment of a ship equipped for top to bottom research in the not yet emerged field of Geophysics, of which terrestrial Magnetism was the direct predecessor and Cambridge Research Labs, the direct progeny.

rose
Last edited by re-rose rose on Wed Jul 27, 2016 7:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby nate » Wed Jul 27, 2016 1:19 am

Hi Rose. It is indeed interesting that a private research vessel would take over a role that a US Naval vessel had been doing. Also interesting that the 1932 records were "lost" when ocean magnetic fields were the primary basis for military navigation. "Classified" would make more sense.

Of course Vening Meinescz being Dutch could be another explanation - the German invasion of the Netherlands wouldn't have helped, if he held the data himself. I wonder if that's a reason for the Caroline cruise? Better not to trust the data to a national military in an age of international tension?

Regards,
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby re-rose rose » Wed Jul 27, 2016 3:43 pm

Nate,
just to be clear about this:

Also interesting that the 1932 records were "lost" when ocean magnetic fields were the primary basis for military navigation.


When I said the records were "lost" I meant the overall results of the 2nd IPY, Not the VM results, specifically. His report of the trip is held by the engineering library at Penn State, though why there, I am not sure.

All I know about the university in the pre-war era is that Nitinol was discovered there under contract to NOL, the Naval Ordinance lab. In the early days, this research was probably conducted by the Minerals Research Department (mining was the heart of the state's economy).

Penn State would go on to become a world class leader in advanced Materials Research and the modern Materials Research lab claims fame in three areas:

Three important events in its history were the work on multilayer capacitors with Erie Technological Products and Sprague Electric leading to the formation of the NSF Center for Dielectric Studies; the longstanding programme on piezoelectric transducers sponsored by the ONR which led to new families of composite ferroelectrics, to phased array ultrasound, and to near perfect electromechanical coupling factors; and the electrostriction measurements on relaxor ferroelectrics which played a key role in the development of reliable active optics systems.

https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... ays_at_MRL

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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby Linda Brown » Wed Jul 27, 2016 5:47 pm

When the Germans took over his home in the Netherlands Dr. M ran an intelligence operation in his own basement... unknown to the officers upstairs. He was quite a figure and highly respected in certain fields.
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby re-rose rose » Wed Jul 27, 2016 7:40 pm

I like to imagine that Dr. Meinescz had access to a gravitic radio, Linda.

Since Townsend's Structure of Space II has come up again:

It was written while he was at Vega, but the handwritten copy is not classified.

Is it a stretch to think he first wrote an SoS I that held the sensitive content?

He would have had access to all the Canadian/British/American foundational data from many terrestrial magnetism, atmospheric, and gravity studies conducted within the previous decade, so whatever he wrote would likely have been a synthesis of state of the art knowledge at the radio/radar/atmospheric research.

I believe it might have also incorporated knowledge that came to him from the damp postcard ephiphany he had on the way to Vega at the end of 1942.

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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby Linda Brown » Mon Aug 01, 2016 2:58 am

I think that you are right on. That postcard revealation was a massive situation for Dad because I honestly do not think that he knew what the " next move" was until that moment. Mr. Twigsnapper has said that it was as if he was a submarine released on its next mission... put to sea... without knowing what its mission was.... until that postcard situation happened. After that I think that he knew everything in a flash.

fragments all finding their spot in the quilt that we are making......... Linda
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Re: Meanwhile, back on the SS Caroline

Postby nate » Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:53 am

Linda Brown wrote:I think that you are right on. That postcard revealation was a massive situation for Dad because I honestly do not think that he knew what the " next move" was until that moment. Mr. Twigsnapper has said that it was as if he was a submarine released on its next mission... put to sea... without knowing what its mission was.... until that postcard situation happened. After that I think that he knew everything in a flash.


I'd love to know what that "postcard epiphany" was! But the phrase "What happens at Vega, stays at Vega" is too good a pun to pass up.

Regards, Nate
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